Correct specs of the Hi12 and Z8300

[Anonymous]

The story about the Z8300 and the wrong intel ARK description has interested me. The Hi12 is such an amazing tablet for the amount of money you are paying for it. Yes, I’d like to pay about $50-75 extra for a Z8500 or Z8700, but I haven’t seen them yet in such a complete package like the Hi12. Recently more tablets with the Z8300 have been introduced, so I can only imagine myself waiting for another year to see ~12 inch Z8550 and Z8750 tablets. I lost interest in the Core M tablets because of the lack of support for Android, and it’s too pricey for what I’ll be doing with it, like internet, e-mail etc. (Chinese Core M tablets are however still very cheap compared to Samsung, Asus etc. devices with Core M)

I’ll get back to the main reason I bought the Hi12: the “mysterious” Z8300. The current mysteries I am trying to solve are:
– Is the 4GB memory in dual channel mode or not?  It’s single channel 🙁 Chuwi lied to me! (Chuwi site says dual channel…)
– At what speed is the 4GB memory running? (and at what latencies) 1600Mhz, speed is all right. Probably has standard latencies we usually see with 1600Mhz DDR3 RAM.
– Is the USB3.0 port on the Hi12 facilitated by the Z8300 or some ASMedia/Renesas pci-e chip? It is facilitated by the Intel SoC.(otg usb port) I wonder if the micro USB port works as USB slave… (when Android is ever released)
– Why is the passmark CPU rating higher compared to the Z3736F, but lower in the Geekbench score? (links/sources provided below) This is probably not such a big mystery, but I’m still curious if the Z3736F is actually faster.
– Can we overclock the Z8300? I think not because it is such a simple Atom chipset, but I’d like to hear some thoughts about this. User “Laura” says we can’t. It’s what I was expecting, but it would be nice if we could overclock it.

I also have some questions about the Hi12:
– Does it support fast charge? (english “flyer”/spec site says yes it can with 3A! Chinese “flyer” site says 3A, Chinese spec site says 2A…) And why did Chris get a 2.5A Charger?
– Is the screen actually 400 lumens at full brightness? I think Christian measured something around 300 lumens? (that is a big difference…)
– Does it have windows 32 or 64 bit? It’s 64 bit thankfully.
– And what languages are available?

I have reason to believe the Z8300 is actually an underclocked Z8500. Why? For the following reasons:
– 4GB RAMs support. The datasheet is clear about this not begin possible. I know websites like intel ARK can be wrong, but messing up datasheets is a BIG mistake.
– The Hi12 with it’s USB3.0 port and Z8300 combo shouldn’t be possible without some PCI-e to USB3.0 chip. The datasheet says USB3.0 is not supported on the Z8300. It does however mention USB3.0 OTG being available. It could be that Chuwi have actually converted this OTG port to a permanent USB3.0 port. I do wonder if the Hi12 would be released with Android and if the micro USB port is able to provide USB slave capabilities… (I think only the OTG port can do that)
– The MIPI DSI (display interface) of the Z8300 has a maximum resolution of 1900×1200. There is no software hack possible to get more out of this, this is hardware afaik. The Hi12 screen however has a lot more pixels than that, so how is Chuwi able to get this kind of resolution? Ow wait, the Z8500/Z8700 supports a maximum resolution of 2560×1600…
– The X98 Pro with it’s Z8500 has practically the same scores as the Surface 3 with it’s Z8700. Why are these scores so close the each other? The mipad has the same cpu yet it reached MUCH lower scores. It’s almost as if the X98 Pro has a Z8700 inside… (or those benchmark scores are invalid)

My best guess: Intel is supplying Z8300 chips which are actually underclocked Z8500 chips. (unless we can overclock the cpu of course…) Intel is probably only making Z8700 chips. Then some bad ones become Z8500’s and some more bad ones become Z8300’s. This is mostly how chips become certain type of chips in the factories.

Chuwi Hi12 Chinese spec site: http://www.chuwi.com/product/items/Hi12.html
Chuwi H12 English spec site: http://en.chuwi.com/product/items/Chuwi-Hi12.html

Z3736F geekbench and passmark(random devices):
http://browser.primatelabs.com/geekbench3/3196303
http://www.passmark.com/baselines/V8/display.php?id=57631504253

Z8300 geekbench and passmark(random devices):
http://browser.primatelabs.com/geekbench3/5531498
http://www.passmark.com/baselines/V8/display.php?id=58067446199

So, if anyone has the Hi12 already, please check if you can answer any of these questions. When I get my Hi12 I can answer them myself, but that will take 2 weeks from now I guess. And of course, please share your thoughts on these questions/points. I’d love to hear some good criticism! 🙂

PS: Sorry for the big post. 😛

[PFN Kim]

Very interesting.

It can explain why we can’t see 8500 or 8700 tablets anymore.

When you get your answer soon, please share it

[BoORD_L]

8000 serie datasheet: https://www-ssl.intel.com/content/www/us/en/processors/atom/atom-z8000-datasheet-vol-1.html

I agree with you.

looking at that specs 8300 can’t handle more than 2GB and 1900×1200 res.

Really strange.

 

What I've used and what I've got:
TECLAST X98 AIR 3G, TECLAST X98 AIR II, TECLAST X98 PRO,CHUWI HI8, CHUWI HI12, CUBE I9

[BoORD_L]

Look at pages 17-18 and 24.

Specs are more similar to T4 soc (8500) than T3 (8300) except for cpu freq.

i repeate… strange

for easy learning i have attached z800 datasheet

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What I've used and what I've got:
TECLAST X98 AIR 3G, TECLAST X98 AIR II, TECLAST X98 PRO,CHUWI HI8, CHUWI HI12, CUBE I9

[Anonymous]

Having bought the Teclast x98 Plus (4GB RAM, Z8300 CPU) for 150euros I can’t see how the Chuwi Hi12 can be considered “amazing value” for the 250$-225€ it is selling at.

It’s it just the only tablet with a 3:2 among the Chinese manufacturers and it’s capitalizing on that…+60euros for a 3:2 screen is too much, compared to the ultra high resolution screen the Teclast has (also renown LG IGZO – Ipad Air panel).

It just invites you to pay a little more and get a Core M tablet.

[BoORD_L]

i’ve spent about 200€.

Construction quality, perfomance, heat managing, connectivity (full size usb ports) matter.

look at chris review about this tablet and teclast x98 plus (worst z8300 on market)

It will give you all the  answers needed

What I've used and what I've got:
TECLAST X98 AIR 3G, TECLAST X98 AIR II, TECLAST X98 PRO,CHUWI HI8, CHUWI HI12, CUBE I9

[Gabriele Adragna]

In teory Everything that has a frequency can be overclocked, so from the bios You should be able to overclock the cpu by the BTK,  Chris should try This and if it work make a video about temperature and battery drain

[PiT]

I think is for sure Z8300 first Intel information shows

:Max Memory Size (dependent on memory type) 2 GB

so i think dependent make a difference maybe it can only it will worked at single channel , second GPU can`t 1900×1200 handle also it shows only differences with frequencies

:

CPU	GPU Base Speed	GPU Boost / Turbo
Intel Atom x7-Z8700	4 x 1600 MHz	200 MHz	600 MHz
Intel Atom x5-Z8500	4 x 1440 MHz	200 MHz	600 MHz
Intel Atom x5-Z8300	4 x 1440 MHz	200 MHz	500 MHz
min. – max.		200 – 200 MHz	500 – 600 MHz

and third Z8300 has USB 3.0.

 

Yuandao N70|ColorFly 808 3G|Chuwi HI12 + (128GB microSD;GPS VK-172 MCDODO case:Stylus Pro Fine)

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Having bought the Teclast x98 Plus (4GB RAM, Z8300 CPU) for 150euros I can’t see how the Chuwi Hi12 can be considered “amazing value” for the 250$-225€ it is selling at. It’s it just the only tablet with a 3:2 among the Chinese manufacturers and it’s capitalizing on that…+60euros for a 3:2 screen is too much, compared to the ultra high resolution screen the Teclast has (also renown LG IGZO – Ipad Air panel). It just invites you to pay a little more and get a Core M tablet.

The cheapest I can find the X98 plus for is $180, while the Hi12 is $230. (both prices from banggood actually). That is a difference of $50. Here’s my explanation for you:
– Better screen. (it’s bigger, less used and also less produced) The ipad like screens are widely available and have been for multiple years now. I haven’t seen that much popular 12 inch tablets with the resolution of the Hi12. So my guess it this screen is at least $20-$40 more expensive.
– The Hi12 is a 12 inch tablet which is not such a popular size. (not yet at least) Less competition in the 12 inch market, so prices are higher. (not sure how this effects the price, but believe me it does)
– The Hi12 has full size USB ports which take up more PCB space. (extra ports+pcb space = at least an extra $4)
– The Hi12 has a special keyboard dock connector, this make the casing more difficult to produce and make assembly also more expensive. (costs at least $5 extra)
– The cooling of the Hi12 is much better. It has the best heat dissipation. (not because of it’s size, but because of thermal pads) Costs an extra $3 I think.
– The battery of the Hi12 is larger. (8000mAh vs 11000mAh) Since batteries are quite expensive, my best guess is this $10 extra.
– Slower eMMC memory. You might think this is not such a big difference, but it actually is. Take a look at the price difference when comparing the Samsung EVO 64GB micro sd VS Samsung Pro 64GB micro sd card. Price difference is about €20, so say $20 dollars. Since the speed difference is not the same as the micro sd cards mentioned, I guess the price difference is about $10.

Add it all up and this is what you get: A price difference of about $52-$72. The reason I bought the Hi12, is that it was cheap. $230 in almost the cost for making this product. I am guessing that Intel is trying to get rid of the chips. Maybe labeling the Z8500 as Z8300 to be able to sell them at lower prices.
Another example for you:
I ordered a Flir E4 thermal heat camera. I converted it to a Flir E8 by software. This increased the value of this camera from €1000 to €5000. Remember that companies don’t always produce the best products they have. Sometimes they only have good products which will become less valued products. This is how the world works! Unfortunately the Z8300 are programmed by Intel. (no way that we can convert it to a Z8500 😛

I can give you another example for the Core M tables vs the Hi12 tablet. But Core M tablets are simply to expensive for me. I do have enough money to buy it if I wanted to, I just think it would be a waist to buy such a tablet. For internet only, the Hi12 will do just fine.

So maybe intel as a hugh stock of Z8500 chips since I haven’t seen much tablets with this cpu. Maybe the Z8300 has been released by intel in the T4 package. The T4 package has more pins, thus enabling more capabilities. The T3 package of the chip is just a smaller version of the T4 package.(to save space on the pcb)
I think we need to get our hands on a newer datasheet. This would also explain why 4GB of ram is supported.(more pins=more pins for RAM memory 😉 )
I really hope it is dual channel, but I think Intel locked it to single channel… (yes, I mean LOCKED)

To Chris: Please check if the Hi12 has dual channel memory and if the USB3.0 port is provided by an external chip or by the SoC itself.

[Anonymous]

BoORD_L wrote:

i’ve spent about 200€. Construction quality, perfomance, heat managing, connectivity (full size usb ports) matter. look at chris review about this tablet and teclast x98 plus (worst z8300 on market) It will give you all the answers needed

I don’t need a review of the Teclast x98 Plus, which I own…I have faced no lag in games etc as mentioned in the review. The only real problem with this tablet is the low sound….what is surprisingly excellent is its Bluetooth signal…

Are 40 euros worth the full usb port  and the screen, but the greater weight and size? Perhaps, if you want to try something new.

But above 200€ I don’t think its worth it really…getting too close to the Core M + SSD tablet…at the end of the day it’s still a Z8300 with eMMC

It is just a shame they didn’t use higher specifications on this package.

 

EDIT: Didn’t see your new answer there.

 

The Cube i7 Stylus now sells for 304.99$ at Gearbest – 12% if you use a cashback site (givingassistant.org)…that is around 270$

I will try and answer point by point

1. The fact that the Hi12 screen is rarer doesn’t make it better. The LG IGZO display of the Teclast x98 is really good and I care about the end result.
2. Sure, lack of competitive products drives the price up, but this is an explanation, it does not do any good to my pocket book.
3. Sure, I clearly recognize the full USB ports as a definite plus for the tablet…but still, that may have an effect on rigidity of the frame as well….recently saw a picture of a tablet cracked at the position of the full usb ports….so if we are going to count advantages and disadvantages in the way you are doing, we should really take note of that too
4. Again about the docking ports, you are explaining from the manufacturing point of view, but the thing is not all people will use them…especially if the Keyboard costs 50$
   …that’s almost ridiculous really, because you can get an awesome Logitech Keyboard with less money on Ebay…I would never count on the benefits of a chinese keyboard like that, I am too demanding on typing.
5. The Teclast x98 Plus I have faced no issues with throttling while playing games and it is also full aluminum frame. Is heat dissipation better in the Chuwi? Seems so, but if I get no side-effects, I don’t really care.
6. The battery of Chuwi Hi12 is larger, but again you are approaching the issue wrong…as a consumer you should be asking about battery autonomy, not battery size…if the battery autonomy is better with Teclast x98, why should I care about the actual size of it?
7. The eMMC chips used vary a lot…you can’t argue that Chuwi Hi12 has faster drive, based on single sample that may have had better performing cells…
   ….we are going to have to wait and see how Chuwi deals with demand for this tablet, what hardware it will use to equip the tablet.
   …in Teclast x98 Plus write speeds may vary, even with renown brands like Samsung, but it’s too early to call a winner there.

 

Now, along with the benefits of the larger tablet you get some drawbacks as well, i.e.

• greater weight: not going to be holding this in one hand for long
• bigger dimensions: this is not the tablet you would easily carry around. You can tell the size-difference in the review video
• lack of accessories: I would not buy a tablet without a proper case and all existing cases for Chuwi Hi12 require you to operate it “naked”

[Anonymous]

Ok, we shouldn’t talk about which tablet is more value for money. For me the Hi12 is more value for money, for you it’s the X98 Plus. I basically want a small laptop that I can also use as tablet. I also bought the keyboard dock which makes it a whole lot better for me to use as a laptop.

I shouldn’t have reacted in such a way, everybody made his own choice based on their preferences of course. 😉

So does anybody have a Hi12 here? Please report yourself!

[PFN Kim]

What is your problem Vgiozo? Cant you read the title?

This is not the “Envying hi12 thread”.  Get away and make your own thread

[BoORD_L]

vgiozo we all are happy that you are happy (sorry for repetition) of your teclast x98 plus.

Anyway I DO prefer x5 series couse it support android , Core M doesn’t.

Hi12 suites my needs completly.

 

EDIT: i owned teclast x98 air 3g and teclast air II. they both died after 1 year of use. Ok i was unlucky but Teclast construction quality is one of the worst seen up to now… just second to onda. Heat managing matter

What I've used and what I've got:
TECLAST X98 AIR 3G, TECLAST X98 AIR II, TECLAST X98 PRO,CHUWI HI8, CHUWI HI12, CUBE I9

[Gabriele Adragna]

Paese, Someone that own the chuwi hi12 can tell me how is the wifi compared to a non chinese tablet?

[Anonymous]

BoORD_L wrote:

vgiozo we all are happy that you are happy (sorry for repetition) of your teclast x98 plus. Anyway I DO prefer x5 series couse it support android , Core M doesn’t. Hi12 suites my needs completly. EDIT: i owned teclast x98 air 3g and teclast air II. they both died after 1 year of use. Ok i was unlucky but Teclast construction quality is one of the worst seen up to now… just second to onda. Heat managing matter

Well, actually Core M can: http://techtablets.com/2015/08/onda-v919-g-core-m-dual-boot-bios-image-and-rom-downloads-online/
It’s just that Core M tablets are mostly windows because it can handle windows with ease. Android is much lighter. I don’t think we are ever going to see a seriously great Core M tablet with dual boot. I am NEVER EVER going to get an Onda. I bought one a few years back (with an Allwinner A10 chip) and the battery has already died(I fixed it with some soldering, but still). My other Allwinner A10 tablet is working just fine after all these years. And Onda did some other nasty stuff with this tablet, so no more crappy Onda for me. My teclast x98 Air 3G however is doing just fine, no problems at all. But it is my second one, my first one had GPU issues(known issue). So now Chuwi, fingers crossed!

Gabriele Adragna wrote:

Paese, Someone that own the chuwi hi12 can tell me how is the wifi compared to a non chinese tablet?

Check the review from Chris, quote from his review:
“I experienced no limited or dropped connections and was able to get the following speeds using speedtest.net. (Note my desktop gets 50 Mbps download and 25 Mbps upload)

***Speedtest.net screenshot***

The Realtek 150mbps Wireless N card was also able to keep up with streaming GTA V over my network as tested here from my tower PC. Using my Hi12 downstairs, I noticed a the performance was still good and the connection is as good as my Surface Pro 4. No problems with the Wifi what-so-ever here.”

[Author]

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